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Post by NellyDee on Oct 30, 2015 16:10:50 GMT
I am getting a wee bit fed up with the pine martens. I put out a couple of bowls (two different locations) with sultanas in, which they seem to love, however they always, when finished pee in the bowl. Any ideas as to why, do they do this with food in the wild? The two junior pine martens, eat together out the bowl, taking it in turns, then both bum over and pee in the bowl.
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Post by aeshna5 on Oct 30, 2015 16:42:09 GMT
Territorial marking- many mammals use their urine to communicate + can indicate sex, age, fitness, etc.
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Post by accipiter on Oct 30, 2015 17:40:44 GMT
There is a school of thought that this can also be related to an anxiety complex in animals as well as a territory marker, which makes sense when one thinks about it! Alan lost in the woods still reviewing the situation
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Post by dogghound on Oct 30, 2015 21:21:13 GMT
The fact it's on a regular area containing food would suggest that they are staking their claim to the food location to dissuade other martens feeding on it or coming to it. They seldom come across fixed feeding sites naturally, but related species will urinate on or near large carrion if they are repeatedly coming back to it.
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Post by rowanberry on Oct 30, 2015 22:26:36 GMT
I've noticed the fox that comes in our garden does the same- cocks his leg over the bowl when he's finished eating. I always presumed it was to dissuade the neighbourhood cats from finishing his leftovers!
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Post by Tringa on Oct 31, 2015 9:20:00 GMT
Same with the martens here. I assume it is scent marking as it is done all over - around the food, on the windowsill, on the edge of the water bowl, on the path.
The first time I noticed I was surprised to find that it does not smell - well not to humans (or perhaps it is not very long lasting). It is very different with foxes, for example. There is never any doubt if a fox has scented in the garden.
Dave
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Post by accipiter on Oct 31, 2015 9:32:05 GMT
As a matter of interests is your fox a male Rowanberry? It is like saying stay away this is mine I am king bee around here (the alpha male.) Male dogs tend to do this as well which is where the anxiety complex fits in the alpha female in a group can also do this, I was told this by a vet I once knew when one of my Labradors was repeatedly doing this years ago in his food bowl.
Alan, in the music room composing
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Post by NellyDee on Oct 31, 2015 9:36:07 GMT
Agree on the sent marking - thanks, I presume it might also indicate family, as my pine martens are a mum and two kids (well they are quite big now), but always appear at the same time, Mum always goes to bowl that is away from the house, the two kids come to the patio. Their markings don't detract the badger, mum pine marten and badger feed in the same area, usually within about an hour of each other, though I do think it is the badger that makes them all run off. Agree with fox marking - had a nightmare with them when I lived in London, had upwards of 7 passing through each night, they liked to go get the ducks at local park.
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Post by Tringa on Nov 2, 2015 9:30:49 GMT
Agree about the badgers making the martens leave.
Very rarely have we seen badgers and martens together and the martens always leave. Usually the martens see or hear the badger and leave before it gets anywhere near. On a couple of occasions the badger has arrived before the marten spotted it but the marten then made a hasty retreat, such as in the video I posted in the camera traps section.
Dave
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Post by rowanberry on Nov 2, 2015 11:37:55 GMT
Accipiter- the fox that comes in the day is a male, but there is also one that comes after dark- a vixen, that I believe is his mate. Once, I caught a glimpse of both of them at dusk together, (I like to think he brought her over for dinner ) and now she comes usually in the late evening. I've put their bowl up close to the house so that I could keep an eye on it. She doesn't hang about- knocks the plantpot over that I put over the bowl to deter cats, eats as fast as she can and then sometimes does a quick squat over the bowl and vanishes. Every now and again she carries the plastic plantpot up to the other end of the garden and hides it in the hedge for me to try and find the next morning...they made off with two dog bowls before I finally got a heavy ceramic one to stop them nicking that, too... I have visons of an urban fox den stocked with dog bowls from all around the local area... my theory is that because the food appears as if by magic, their little foxy brains have rationalised that if they simply take the bowl home with them, then it might just start producing dinner for them on the spot. Or then again, maybe it's simply to protect the dish from the cats. Anyway, the vixen doesn't pee in the dish every time- and interestingly, it doesn't smell as strong as when the male does it.
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Post by aeshna5 on Nov 2, 2015 14:57:17 GMT
When I've been in the Rothiemurchus estate hide I've seen Badgers + Pine Martens on both occasion, but the Pine Martens make them scarce when the Badgers turn up but return once the Badgers leave.
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Post by NellyDee on Nov 2, 2015 18:05:45 GMT
Had to laugh rowanberry at your comments. Oddly it is the pine marten that go off with the feeders, they learnt how to take the fat square feeders down from where they hang under the bird feeders, they carried them off into the scrub and then took the tops off the feeders. Took me almost a year to work out what was doing the pinching and I got fed up buying new containers. They are now out of reach!
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Post by accipiter on Nov 2, 2015 19:48:10 GMT
Thank you for answering Rowanberry I can only envy you for having these beautiful creatures visiting you, ours do run across our lawn from time to time but seem that much more anxious in their behavior being true country foxes. We do also have badgers here too who remain very elusiveā but do insist in leaving their latrines in the most unexpected places!
Alan
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